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Post by Buckeye Dave on Sept 4, 2007 7:11:21 GMT -5
My honest opinion is that I haven't heard the announcement of Lloyd Carr's resignation.
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Post by Pirate Joe on Sept 4, 2007 7:26:25 GMT -5
I am waiting for lLoyd to call a press conference and start slappin' himself upside the head....
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Post by cff on Sept 4, 2007 8:06:49 GMT -5
NCBD, don't take things so personally. Vanderbilt is much improved and should upset someone this year. That said, they never should have beaten UGA last year. UGA has twice as much talent, and your coach is supposed to be among the elite (I heard everyone talking of how great he is in the offseason). How is that having it both ways, break it down, look at it, then it will make sense.
After the game, Carr also took a shot at Vandy, saying that Ap State was the toughest opening day opponent that they have had recently. Ap. State is a team that lost to NC State last year. That doesn't mean much this year, but I doubt they will be undefeated come seasons end.
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Post by nvajacketsfan on Sept 4, 2007 8:08:08 GMT -5
Out of the top 25. They looked slow. The only offensive weapon that was hitting was Hart, and he is battling an injury already.
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Post by raleighrebel on Sept 4, 2007 9:19:36 GMT -5
App State is better than a lot of D-I teams. Hell, they are better than Ole Miss I bet. They are probably better than the bottom teams in all the BCS conferences. So what if Indiana would have beaten UM?
It is not about talent, it is about perception. And the perception is awful for UM.
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Post by dpb13 on Sept 4, 2007 9:32:09 GMT -5
All I know is I'm not sure I'd want to be Oregon right about now. It's a no-win situation. If they win, well then they just did what App. State did. If they lose....
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Post by raleighrebel on Sept 4, 2007 9:35:17 GMT -5
All I know is I'm not sure I'd want to be Oregon right about now. It's a no-win situation. If they win, well then they just did what App. State did. If they lose.... amen to that
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Post by Geaux Tigers on Sept 4, 2007 10:38:43 GMT -5
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Post by Geaux Tigers on Sept 4, 2007 10:39:19 GMT -5
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Post by brutusbeliever on Sept 4, 2007 10:48:32 GMT -5
Kudos to you, Geaux. Brutus
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Post by cff on Sept 4, 2007 11:32:17 GMT -5
Saban is probably waiting for the Vandy job to open, Michigan has no shot.
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Post by nvajacketsfan on Sept 4, 2007 13:04:45 GMT -5
Out of the top 25. They looked slow. The only offensive weapon that was hitting was Hart, and he is battling an injury already. At 27!
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Post by stillaridah on Sept 4, 2007 15:18:54 GMT -5
Geuax, OUTSTANDING!!!!! Karma for you Brotha
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Post by teddydupay4 on Sept 4, 2007 19:35:35 GMT -5
I personally and honestly think Michigan is a bad football team. They've been this way for a long while, but talent often masks poor discipline and execution. I'm beginning to think more and more that Carr didn't win a national title b/c he schemed and dreamed the right way in 1997, but b/c there was a bevy of NFL stud talent on that roster that even under Carr's tutledge could not be fucked with very easily. Cato June, Brian Griese, Steve Hutchinson, Jon Jansen, Anthony Thomas, Ian Gold, Sam Sword, Dante Jones, and of course Charles Woodson all went on to productive if not excellent NFL careers. Carr has always recruited well, but so have guys like Al Groh and Ron Zook.
This current version is a culmination of Carr's worst work. It's one thing to play down to your opponents, his teams have always done that. But it used to be that they played UP to better teams, like Ohio State in the mid-late 90s. They showed character. Now, they're all talk. The defense is lame. You'd think @ the very least, guys would be sick and tired of hearing about how last year's D choked ass late and guys hungry for a starting job would step up. Wrong. And they're veteran guys too. Kids that have played meaningul minutes, if not starting their careers before this.
On offense Chad Henne is probably the worst QB Carr has had. I blasted him when he recruited Navarre, who was mostly given scholarships to play DE, which he starred more @ out of a high school in Wisconsin. But Navarre if not spectacular improved every season. Still, it was a bad position for us. Henne came in looking good and has regressed each year. He makes mistakes now that he made in his first start against ND. Those type of things aren't supposed to happen. The line, chock full of standout recruits as well has always run blocked well, but has struggled to protect Henne. Long is a stud, but he's been thru major injuries.
Still honestly, talent wise overall this is one of the top teams in the country. The problem is, Michigan always is talent wise. There's no heart on this team...only in mildly arrogant Mike Hart who seems to be the only one to give a shit, whether you like it or not. The real issue is that Carr is having the same problems he had 10 years ago with the same offenses. He coaches not to lose instead of to win. He makes adjustments, but won't trust the same things that worked in the 3rd quarter later on in the 4th.
This is a talented Michigan team, but not an inspired one. Like I said...beat Oregon and ND, especially Oregon...they could win 8, maybe compete in the Big 10 if a few things fall well, and go to a bowl game. Lose in the same fashion they lost to so many teams like Oregon beforehand, this will be 2 year's agos Tennessee. Nebraska when Callahan started. ND since Holtz retired. Another glamourous program on the skids. I think this loss could be a program breaker honestly. If I'm a high school cat looking @ a few schools to ply my trade craft and Michigan was in my short list...I turn on the TV Saturday and see that...then see the residual aftermath the media has wrought upon the program, and there's NO WAY I still go there. It looks shameful. I wish them the best and will always be a fan, but I see the demise on the horizon. I'd personally be surprised if we play in a bowl game this season.
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Post by sooner711 on Sept 4, 2007 21:12:38 GMT -5
All I know is I'm not sure I'd want to be Oregon right about now. It's a no-win situation. If they win, well then they just did what App. State did. If they lose.... This could be one of my favorite football weekends ever. OU has a chance to demolish Miami...a revenge game for us fans, and the team App. St. beat is really pissed and gets to take it out on Oregon. If these two come through, I will be a very happy man.
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Post by USCGamecocks on Sept 4, 2007 21:13:38 GMT -5
Not still bitter are we?
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Post by sooner711 on Sept 4, 2007 21:24:55 GMT -5
Lol. Bitter in a fun sort of way. ;D
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Post by vitruvianman on Sept 5, 2007 11:37:57 GMT -5
I just think the game has passed Carr by. It happens. He is a BO disciple, and I think Michigan needs to now get away from that. The "Michigan man" thing sounds fine and dandy, but they need a NEW Michigan man. Really, Michigan can attract almost any coach they want.
Henne has a cannon for an arm, but he doesn't seem to have a lot of touch on his passes. I think sometimes he throws the ball TOO hard. He had some drops against App St, but these were as much his fault as the receivers. Michael Vick throws this way too.
"demise on the horizon"? Thats a little doom-and-gloom isn't it? This loss could affect recruiting in the short term.......and for selfish reasons, I hope it does. But long term, Michigan will be fine. They always are. When they get a new coach in there, there will be excitement about the program again.
PS- Why didn't they go deep to Manningham a few more times? He caught that late long pass easily against the App St defense. I think he could have torn that defense a new one
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Post by teddydupay4 on Sept 5, 2007 12:29:39 GMT -5
1. I have no idea why they didn't go deep to him. Maybe Henne figured what happened against OSU would happen again...40 yards over his head.
2. The phrase "Michigan man" is overused. Bo said it when Bill Freider left the basketball team @ the alter days before the NCAAs. Fisher took over, the rest is history. Michigan has shown that it is not necessary to hire a "Michigan man" in hoops. Tommy Amaker was a Dukie. Beilien has very slim ties to the state, let alone the university. Football wise, Bo wasn't even a "Michigan man." He was of OSU timber. Moeller was a Bo guy, as was Carr. That's not a very long lineage.
3. They need a coach who will preach discipline and not hide behind pre-cocted statments. They need a guy like Tressel. A guy that won before and expects to win. A guy that when asked about stopping the spread, about beating the rival, about discipline problems and arrogance...will take it on instead of acting like it doesn't exist with bullshit media rhetoric. Like I said, Michigan is getting TORN apart by the media. Kids aren't wanting to go there right now. This could be as long term as Alabama or Notre Dame, both of whom are a shell of what they were 15 years ago. I don't understand how we still have the same issues as 10 years ago. I don't understand how Carr goes from being a great big game coach to one that couldn't beat a YMCA flag football team if there was something legit on the line. These are things I don't understand. Where's the pride?
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Post by stillaridah on Sept 5, 2007 13:23:29 GMT -5
I think that the biggest question that has not been brought up is where was the senor leadership when things started going south in the game? I am sorry but if you are suppose to have 3 heisman candidates on the team, one of them has to step up in the second quarter and say HEY "this shit is unacceptable!!!" I watched the game I didn't see any of that.
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